UCLA Med Ctr-CA

good

I've heard mixed htings. It's likely to be good if you fit the ~vibes~ of the students she's mentored over the years

aka asian girl?

also she def has favorites

she will pay you DUST if you aren't asian, white, light-skin hispanic lol

so she doesn't like black people? dark skinned hispanics? and indians?

no lol

allergic to melanin apparently

googled her to see who she is, and with the way she filters her pics to make herself look whiter this seems very believable

Prepare to be a slave

Have heard that you will have to work hard, really hard, but the fellows generally match well. Hard to know whether she selects for people who would have matched well anyways, but definitely plays a role

"I've heard mixed htings. It's likely to be good if you fit the ~vibes~ of the students she's mentored over the years

googled her to see who she is, and with the way she filters her pics to make herself look whiter this seems very believable"

ok I did an away with someone who is from Yale, they really think it was a fluke and the only big thing is that they all wanted to stay in the NE and signaled the same places

4/12 is still kind of bad

Not gonna lie we are scared :(

Why does everybody think Yale deserves a 12/12 match but its cool if lower ranked schools go 0-4/12? Just because someone is "from Yale" doesnt make them more deserving of a spot. Just being honest because Ive met some T5-10 folks and they are insufferable as hell "oh yeah I'm deciding between X Y and Z top program" not even considering the possibility of not matching

this goes for residents too. using school as a strong proxy for derm aptitude is

TEA TIME ANSWERS PLS: Can someone explain why Yale had only 4/12 match derm last year with another 3 students switching into another specialty entirely? 80% of the ENTIRE med school class takes an RY. Is there something going on with their home department. >> What?? 80% of the entire class including other specialties?!

ok I did an away with someone who is from Yale, they really think it was a fluke and the only big thing is that they all wanted to stay in the NE and signaled the same places

OP here, this makes sense! I've always wondered haha

4/12 is still kind of bad

Not gonna lie we are scared :(

Why does everybody think Yale deserves a 12/12 match but its cool if lower ranked schools go 0-4/12? Just because someone is "from Yale" doesnt make them more deserving of a spot. Just being honest because Ive met some T5-10 folks and they are insufferable as hell "oh yeah I'm deciding between X Y and Z top program" not even considering the possibility of not matching

this goes for residents too. using school as a strong proxy for derm aptitude is mildly accurate at best and imprecise at worst

OP here, it's not that everybody from yale deserves a 12/12 match and people from lower ranked schools don't. It's just that historically top school departments very much supported their students and made insane calls to get their students matched, and most people matched each cycle. Usually when a school with a historically strong match record in a specialty starts having poor outcomes, it's because there was a change in home department faculty or someone was promoted to chair/PD and now only wants the people they like to match

thats the general trend on this sheet (not you OP) but people do think school name = more deserving to match

cries in UCLA (to the comment about change in chair)

< low key the worst (as in just bad) co rotators ive had have been from th ebest schools and the best have been from "worse" schools

yah they said several had 8 or more interviews so was a weird falling through the cracks situation maybe who knows but not sure about the part with people switching out last minute that was not discussed

It's a known thing. I'm an MD/PhD and the PhDs who come from less prestigious schools know much more than those that come from more presgious schools because nothing is handed to them. At academic centers that r flushed w cash, everything is handed to everyone so they can focus on sharpening their minds but at institutions with less funding, the people need to do everything themselves, so in the process, they become more competent. Obviously not a catch all, but I've definitely seen this. I can see this happening to surgery residents, as they say, community residents make better physicians. Coming from someone who went to a no name undergrad and am now at a T3.

tough choice maybe UCLA?

tough choice maybe UCLA? < tbh mine is a community program that has a good rep and 1 hour from my hometown

Yes, many. The comment below about only interviewing away rotators is false.

Does anyone know what their interview rate is for gold signals? No data on residency explorer

harbor no, UCLA yes if you are a strong applicant and have ties to the west coast

why no for harbor? is it a wasted signal

Worth sending a gold vs a silver to UCLA?

harbor has 2 residents per year i think.

Harbor only interviews their aways. UCLA if you are a strong applicant with west coast ties -> yes.

how do you explain west coast ties if home address no longer in LA

personalize your personal statement

What about UCLA TY?

UCLA Reagan doesn't have a TY (unless there's a new one that opened this year..?). Harbor UCLA and UCLA Olive View have prelim years. Culture at Olive view is more friendly than Harbor

I think most small programs 2 or fewer reisdents/class tend to take primarily away rotators/fellows not just Mayo AZ, however mayo AZ especially isnt worth it unless you did a research fellowship with them. Sinai also as you said, but they are a big program just with tons of fellows that are essentially guaranteed a spot. UCLA also past years has also taken primarily research fellows. Programs that heavily favor away rotators tend to be NYC programs, especially cornell. Texas programs tend to primarily recruit from texas schools or away rotators with texas connections. USF primarily takes those with regional connections. CWRU usually takes home students and their own research fellows. Wouldnt even bother with the Larkin programs unless you have no other choice and can pay for a spot. Hopefully this is helpful, will try to add more if I think of any

i think this is all good info but if your mentor has connecs and advocates for u, can still get interview w/o rotating/RY

Texas programs will take Texans that went to medical school outside of the state (got interviews at every Texas school I applied to and did medical school in another state - am Texan)

ucsd

ucla or uci for sure

UCI has very strong cosmetics

uci!!

If you're looking at the UCs, would also mention Davis. Get significant cosmetic exposure.

Harbor UCLA, USC, UCLA (if research fellow)

USC is trash

for rotating*

what do you mean by non-ivory tower programs... it's derm.

not op, but I strongly dislike this sentiment that some people have. As much as derm is competitive, there ARE ivory programs and non-ivory programs. Harvard, Yale, Penn, UCSF. An example of a non-ivory program: MCW. There will always be stratifications even in the most competitive of things, and these stratifications are always worth keeping in mind when you can only apply to 28 programs

ivory tower is a meaningless label, the earlier you learn that the better off you'll be

ivory tower is a meaningless label, the earlier you learn that the better off you'll be>>> yeah a ton of harvard/penn/ucsf grades end up going into private practice...

umm, yes ivory tower doesn't mean better training, but it is considered prestigious and harder to match. OP isn't asking about ivory tower programs, they're asking about non-ivory programs, so your "the earlier you learn" comment comes off as not helpful and condescending

this whole let's not talk about the T10 things is weird and comes off as gatekeepy. These programs exist and people will still be applying to them. Besides, I agree with the previous commenter, OP is asking about non-ivory tower/community programs. No need to step up on y'all's soapbox

When I rotated at Orange Park they had MD residents from UMiami and UCLA. But I know at least the UMiami grad rotated there and they seem to highly prefer their rotators.

Can someone elaborate on this "2-3" aways advice? Many times in the other spreadsheet people said to only do 2 due to the APD recommendations.. How enforced/risky is it to do 3?

ask your program leadership to see how much they care about following the rules. If you have no home program however, you can do 3 aways safely. But at a minimum do your 2 aways. I'm seeing people underapplying and ending up with 0-1 aways because they were too picky. And stop rotating at places you have no shot at (rotation mills, harvard/penn tier if you're a regular applicant)

How would you define a not regular applicant?

having just 260+ and RY alone doesn't make you a stand out candidate. these days you need an X factor (wow factor) like being an olympic athlete, MD-PhD published in lancet, started a company or non-profit, etc. it's a lot more competitive than people think and unfortunately people find this out too late.

I'm gonna throw up

Is there any danger in over-applying and then having to turn down programs? Does that disadvantage you in trying to get an interview there?

false you dont need wow factors you just need them to like you, programs pick people they like once basic competence is fulfilled as simple as that sounds

im just answering the original question, not saying that's what you need to match derm. You can match derm in general with a much more average app

each derm program is already oversaturated with increasing internal numbers, research fellows, away rotators, reapps, so getting an interview w/o an away is extremely hard unless you have killer scores. my two cents are to apply and do as many aways as you can, rather than burning any meager bridges you had to begin with by withdrawing from an away. worse case APD guidelines say applicants shouldn't be penalized for withdrawing from aways if they chose to "adhere to the guidelines of 2/3 aways"

APD trying to normalize and abnormal process. You follow the rules and do 2 aways while someone else does 5. Or you do 2 aways and someone else follows the rules with you but secretly has nepo connections with a guaranteed seat somewhere while you're stressing over not matching. Stop handicapping yourself to appease some socially inept out of touch group of nerds

each derm program is already oversaturated with increasing internal numbers, research fellows, away rotators, reapps, so getting an interview w/o an away is extremely hard unless you have killer scores. my two cents are to apply and do as many aways as you can, rather than worry about burning any meager bridges you had to begin with by withdrawing from an away. worse case APD guidelines say applicants shouldn't be penalized for withdrawing from aways if they chose to "adhere to the guidelines of 2/3 aways"

you right my b

I just want to say I didn't have any real problems with securing my aways because I asked my mentors in november if I could rotate the following year. Don't be afraid to ask people who can help you to help you early, because VSLO can be super unpredictable. I think the real race starts even before VSLO lol

Pick your aways carefully

word

I know there’s a list of rotation mills, but it’s also important to consider which programs primarily take their own RY fellows, doing an away rotation there and signaling them is a complete waste

How many aways should we have right now to feel comfortable and not an impending sense of doom

Has anyone heard back from UCLA

matched applicant this cycle here, completely agree with OP. apply aggressively and do as many aways as you can, even if that is 5 or 6 one-month long rotations. It will be exhuasting but Do them, they will yield interviews and while quality> quanitity it is also a numbers game and more interviews = more chances

As a final parting message from a matched re-applicant - the application cycle starts the moment VSLO opens. Right now is the key moment that will lay the foundation of your cycle. People may disagree with me, but I will personally advise anyone reading this to aggressively apply for aways right now. You need, at a minimum, to strive to get 2-3 aways. The more aways you get the better your chance at matching. Keep applying for aways, you may not always get your top choices but something is better than nothing. And use your mentors to help you get aways if you still aren't getting any despite applying to a good # of aways, or if you just want a specific away. Please please please listen to what I am saying to give yourself the best chance at matching.> second this as another matched applicant

Can someone elaborate on this "2-3" aways advice? Many times in the other spreadsheet people said to only do 2 due to the APD recommendations.. How enforced/risky is it to do 3?

ask your program leadership to see how much they care about following the rules. If you have no home program however, you can do 3 aways safely. But at a minimum do your 2 aways. I'm seeing people underapplying and ending up with 0-1 aways because they were too picky. And stop rotating at places you have no shot at (rotation mills, harvard/penn tier if you're a regular applicant)

matched applicant this cycle here, completely agree with OP. apply aggressively and do as many aways as you can, even if that is 5 or 6 one-month long rotations. It will be exhuasting but Do them, they will yield interviews and while quality> quanitity it is also a numbers game and more interviews = more chances

How would you define a not regular applicant?

having just 260+ and RY alone doesn't make you a stand out candidate. these days you need an X factor (wow factor) like being an olympic athlete, MD-PhD published in lancet, started a company or non-profit, etc. it's a lot more competitive than people think and unfortunately people find this out too late.

false you dont need wow factors you just need them to like you, programs pick people they like once basic competence is fulfilled as simple as that sounds

im just answering the original question, not saying that's what you need to match derm. You can match derm in general with a much more average app

you right my b

I'm gonna throw up

Is there any danger in over-applying and then having to turn down programs? Does that disadvantage you in trying to get an interview there?

each derm program is already oversaturated with increasing internal numbers, research fellows, away rotators, reapps, so getting an interview w/o an away is extremely hard unless you have killer scores. my two cents are to apply and do as many aways as you can, rather than worry about burning any meager bridges you had to begin with by withdrawing from an away. worse case APD guidelines say applicants shouldn't be penalized for withdrawing from aways if they chose to "adhere to the guidelines of 2/3 aways"

I just want to say I didn't have any real problems with securing my aways because I asked my mentors in november if I could rotate the following year. Don't be afraid to ask people who can help you to help you early, because VSLO can be super unpredictable. I think the real race starts even before VSLO lol

Pick your aways carefully

word

I know there’s a list of rotation mills, but it’s also important to consider which programs primarily take their own RY fellows, doing an away rotation there and signaling them is a complete waste

How many aways should we have right now to feel comfortable and not an impending sense of doom

Has anyone heard back from UCLA

this made me lol but same

third this 100000x

agree with the prior comment- for every "adhere to APD guidelines" comment there is a response comment saying "they are just guidelines, i did not follow" etc.

Fantastic program in an ideal location. People anonymously rag on it likely to get others to rank it lower. Amazing benefits and strong UC union (make 90-100k). Great work/life balance. They do get a lot of NIH research funding hence the research reputation, but there is only one required research project for residents. Previous comments recommended doing the gen derm away instead of peds derm

the research rep also comes from them matching a lot of MD PhDs but it seems like that trend is going away based of this years list and prior

How do you know who they matchd this year?

list is up. Last year they matched seemingly research heavy people though (one of them only had basic science pubs, no clinical research whatsoever!!)

What about UCLA?

my school (MD OOS) has an affilitation disagreement with them so we can't even rotate there

googling everyone who matched this year to figure out the secret sauce

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